TAG | learner engagement
27
Is there really a Polish stereotypical group behaviour?
0 Comments | Posted by Graham in Learning Experiences, Learning Tools & Resources
RSVP Design was delighted to establish a new distribution relationship in 2011 with Experience Corner, based in Warsaw, Poland. Experience Corner is the first on-line store in Poland offering interactive training tools from globally known brands, and following an invitation from colleagues at Experience Corner, last month I made my first visits to and Krakow and Warsaw to introduce some of our products to their customers. It is always exciting to travel to a new city and although I had just returned from a visit to the USA, I was looking forward to seeing Krakow and watching the reactions of the Polish audience to our products. Alicja and Joanna from Experience Corner met me on the first evening I arrived, but by then I had already had the chance to wander around the main square in Krakow and begin to sample what was clearly a popular and vibrant city!
Experience Corner have translated all the facilitator manuals as well as the delegate briefs for several of our learning tools, so I although I would have an interpreter with me during the events, her main role would simply be to help me understand what was being said in Polish as the groups worked with their own language version materials. The Krakow event was held on a large converted Dutch barge on the river, and I was pleased to see that Experience Corner, like RSVP Design, believes that the learning environment is important in making events memorable for participants! It was a wonderful old vessel, and I could have happily sailed along the river on what was a beautiful sunny day! The delegates were a mixture of internal training specialists and other training consultants, and were extremely enthusiastic in their participation. I used our Images of Organisations™ metaphor cards to open the session and to get pairs and triads discussing what their training challenges were, and I was delighted to see that Polish people have no problems in working with metaphor in this way. We then had a group play Colourblind® with a number of observers and again, not only were they enthusiastic, but very disciplined in their problem solving approaches, which helped them reach a successful conclusion fairly quickly. To show how RSVP Design would sequence activities we then introduced Simbols™ (using the Team Version) to show how we might build on similar behaviours using a different activity, and finished with Challenging Assumptions™ – again it was comforting to see Polish people make exactly the same assumptions in this exercise as other Nationalities we have tried it with around the world!
The following day (well, very early in the morning!) we took the train to Warsaw where I presented to a larger group (some 45 people) in probably my most unusual training venue ever – the deep end of an old swimming pool (thankfully undergoing a conversion to an arts venue!). I was interested to see if our dinner discussion the night before about Polish stereotypical group behaviour suggested by my hosts as being ‘a lot of heated discussion, but when agreement is reached there will be a uniform acceptance of the new direction – perhaps to the detriment of thinking about alternative strategies’. During this larger session I decided to use Webmaster® to see if these behavioural stereotypes would play out. Whether by coincidence or as a reflection of these stereotypes I did indeed witness a lot of heated discussion after the initial problem-solving portion of Webmaster® (creating the first construction). I observed lots of discussion with many overlapping conversations, and several people taking a lead as to how they though they could best achieve the team performance increase required (i.e. complete the whole construction in under 2 minutes, from an original build time of 25 minutes). None of the available exercise time was used for further practice or rehearsal purposes – it was all used for ‘discussion’. Eventually as the time limit began to expire (somehow!) the group agreed on a strategy and every one of the 30 strong group delivered on that strategy and managed to achieve the objective! There was a lot of discussion following this activity (most of which I was unable to understand!), and I get the sense that Webmaster® could become a popular activity in Poland!
Although this was a very short trip I saw enough to know that I want to go back and experience more Polish cooking, Polish beer, Polish socialising and Polish customers, and I look forward to a successful partnership between Experience Corner and RSVP Design.
Graham Cook
As part of our commitment to bringing the concept of Learning Power to businesses, public and third sector adult learning groups, we worked in partnership with NHS Dumfries and Galloway to offer a two-day programme for L+D professionals on July 13 and 14 2011.
Day 1 was an introduction to ELLI and the 7 Dimensions of Learning and was attended by seven participants, from within the NHS, the Scottish Police and Brathay: organisations with a commitment to developing people through the provision of high quality learning.
Day 2 was an optional ‘ELLI Champions’ training day, designed to ensure that those who wish to use the profiling tool within their own programmes have achieved the required level of understanding and competence to represent and administer the tool correctly and in line with the intentions of ViTaL Partnerships, who retain the ownership of the profile and associated research material.
As we have experienced in previous workshops, there was a very positive response from all the participants about the potential value of ELLI across a broad range of applications: in personal coaching and development, in career coaching and in performance management and goal setting.
Participants felt strongly that the ELLI profile is, as it has always been described, of particular value when it forms part of a supportive yet challenging coaching or mentoring relationship. Particularly during Day 2 there was a focus on the principles of effective coaching and the need to use the profile as a trigger for high quality developmental conversations with individual learners.
However, there was also strong agreement that simply understanding the 7 Dimensions, and their implications for the design and delivery of learning experiences, was of enormous value to those professionals who are responsible for the selection or creation of learning activities, programmes and events, as well as the ‘curriculum’ around formal training inputs and mandatory training.
Ann introduced a number of short, example activities on Day 1 to illustrate how, once a need to develop one or more dimensions had been identified, experiential learning methodology can support skills development. Specific example of this included short exercises in connecting apparently random images (Meaning Making), a group puzzle that could only be solved by generating multiple questions (Critical Curiosity) and the use of a visual mapping tool to review past learning and plan for the future (Strategic Awareness).
On Day 2, participants rehearsed their own coaching skills, observing each other and offering and receiving feedback. This process helped them to explore the ‘layers’ that ELLI unlocks: learners’ thoughts and feelings about learning in general, themselves as learners, their motivation and learning needs. Following this, they began to explore how and where ELLI could be integrated into their own work. Examples included an organisational induction process (with recommendations about how to make this much more learner-centred and participative), working with operational managers to help to ensure that appraisal and performance management discussions were more focused on learning and the value of integrating the Learning Power principles into Action Learning sets.
Whilst we recognise that there is still work to do in creating materials and ’seamless’ access to ELLI profiles, the programme re-confirmed RSVP Design’s belief that this is a simple and powerful model that should become core knowledge for every L+D professional.
Specific thanks go to Sandie Wilkie and Louise Hughes of NHS Dumfries and Galloway for their support in setting up the programme and providing the venue and logistical arrangements.
20
Motivation for learning
0 Comments | Posted by Graham in Learning Design, Learning Experiences, Learning Tools & Resources
I read a really interesting BBC article describing how there is strong evidence that universally praising children can de detrimental to their growth, and encourages a ‘fixed mindset’ rather than believing they have the capacity to grow and learn (see http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-13128701 ) . Of course the ELLI research ( see http://rsvpdesign.co.uk/trainer-training/ ) supports this article (both for children and adults) and we are heartened by the almost universal interest in ELLI from any organisation we speak to. There is also good research from other areas that children who value the idea of ‘I am someone who can learn’, and that ‘I can learn from mistakes’, are motivated to ‘grow and learn’ and ‘resilient’ when it comes to challenging learning situations. These type of children grow into valuable employees. I know some educational colleagues who wish they had praised their own children more for effort when they were younger, and now choose to celebrate ‘failure’ as a learning opportunity, even as their children have grown up.
It has prompted me to continue to think about how organisations can generate the same motivation to learn as the people who have all the successful and well researched characteristics of effective learners. I’m convinced that this motivation has to come from an organisational culture that respects individuals as capable of learning and change, and that their leaders should behave in a way that is consistent with that. This would mean abolishing ‘lists of approved training courses’, educating managers and individuals about the science behind effective learning, paying more attention to informal learning than formal learning, re-writing the charter for L&D & OD (or even seeking to phase them out, and give their responsibilites to line managers), and using ‘learning language’ in business contexts so it is seen as being fundamentally critical to achieving any organisational mission or goal. In fact research seems to suggest that’s what organisations who ‘thrive’ actually do – now we just need some good tools to help organisations achieve this …
RSVP Design has created a new joint venture – Mobile Learning Design – and we hope to create some tools that take advantage of the personal nature of mobile devices (smartphones, tablets etc.) to provide formal and informal learning support when people need it, rather than when it is offered. Please get in touch with us if this subject is of interest!
18
A whole new landscape of learning……
0 Comments | Posted by geoff in Learning Design, Learning Experiences
As the spring weather moves towards summer my runs on the mountains and moors of NW England become longer, and I can once more indulge myself in extended and deeply-reflective hours of solitary endeavour. These long runs allow me to follow chains of thought that are difficult to maintain through the complexities of a busy work-life, let alone the happy chaos of home and family! Last weekend I found myself on the familiar terrain of a green ribbon of sheep-cropped turf crossing a sun warmed limestone plateau, perfect for fast miles and expansive thinking.
What occupied my mind was the way in which my work as a designer of learning has changed in a relatively short time, and how these changes might be interpreted to indicate deeper changes in organisational learning.
Not many years ago I would work with clients to define a design brief by asking questions such as “How many people will attend?” “For how long?” “Who are these people?” and “What do you need them to be able to do when the leave the room (that they couldn’t do when they entered)?” This type of question defined the parameters of the learning environment and allowed me to get creative within clearly defined boundaries.
Not many years later I found that I was seeing a move away from this event-based approach. I was working much closer to the power-centres of client organisations, and now the questions were “What organisation-level changes are you trying to achieve?’ “What are the behavioural obstacles and opportunities?” and “What tools and processes do your leaders need to embed these changes?”. The learning environments were less defined, more business-relevant and called for much more depth and subtlety from me as a designer.
More recently still the shifting balance that is rapidly moving emphasis away from formal learning towards informal learning have required a whole different approach and a different set of questions. In 2011 the need for organisations to be agile, responsive and learning-efficient is apparent in every sector, although the results of a failure to achieve these conditions are frequently masked by more fundamental economic failings. Recent conversations with learning and development professionals in these organisations suggest that many are struggling to address these new challenges. Many are caught in the professional paradox of never before having had more responsibility for the future learning needs of their organisation, yet never before having so little control over the ways in which these needs can be addressed.
Perhaps the questions that I now use to frame a design brief are ones that could effectively be used to interrogate the more general learning landscapes within ambitious organisations? The kind of questions I now find myself working with are “What are the learning needs of the organisation?” “Who are the people, inside and outside of this organisation, who could contribute to this learning?””What are your peoples’ strengths, and weaknesses, as learners?” and “What support do they need to take individual ownership of the organisation’s learning needs?”
None of these are easy questions to ask, or to answer, when learning and development is under such extreme pressure to deliver. Arriving at effective answers is business-critical, yet will only be achieved if we recognise that we can’t manage the learning of others in any meaningful way, but we must find ways of supporting their learning to benefit our organisations.
Not an easy route, nor a short route, but a challenge to be relished – a bit like this run!
8
Using experiential learning activities with Senior Leaders
2 Comments | Posted by ann in Learning Design, Learning Experiences, Learning Tools & Resources
Very often, when I describe and demonstrate RSVP Design’s range of experiential learning activities to L+D professionals, consultants and HR advisors, they respond in a predictable fashion. Something along the lines of…
“Yes, I do use games and learning activities like these with some groups but I couldn’t possibly offer these to some of my clients – they are much too senior.”
There seems to be a belief that the more senior a leader or manager in an organisation, the less likely they are to respond positively to learning through the ‘metaphor’ that a well-designed learning activity or simulation offers. It is perceived that these activities add value, for example, to a team-building event or to a management skills workshop for young employees but that they are, in some way, inappropriate for more senior leaders. There is a fear and anxiety about offering a form of learning that is seen as too trivial for senior executive education.
“I couldn’t offer that at Board level – they simply wouldn’t engage with it…..”
Our experience is exactly the opposite. The more senior and successful leaders are in a business environment, the more likely they are to engage with the learning activities we offer and to play, experiment and challenge their own learning and performance. They ‘get it’. They have the ability to see beyond the presenting activity and understand the processes it mirrors. They are also confident enough in themselves that they have nothing to prove – they are ‘comfortable in their own skins’ and able to demonstrate a willingness to step outside of their comfort zone -even if it means short-term failure – in order to develop their own, and their organisations’, performance.
Ben Bryant, a skilled and experienced psychologist, is Professor of Leadership and Organization at IMD. He commissioned RSVP Design recently to work with him on perhaps the most senior programme we have ever delivered. The participants built geometric shapes out of plastic construction components, raced wheeled vehicles along the floor and connected complex webs of coloured ropes in order to solve a puzzle. They were completely engaged and immediately able to make the connections between what they were doing and the leadership capability they were at IMD to develop.
Ben explained this to us from a psychologist’s perspective. He confirmed that it is all about ego. These leaders are so senior they’ve left their egos behind. They don’t have to prove themselves – their track records stand for themselves. They can make the connections, see the big picture, be confident in their own abilities – confident enough to allow themselves to play, get things wrong, make a fool of themselves, knowing that that is crucial in learning and innovating. They can see the parallels in the ’simulated world’ and the ‘concrete world’.’
In contrast, we experience much more resistance from more junior team leaders and managers – the very people for whom these activities are often chosen. Many of them are likely to be working from a position of uncertainty and anxiety and they need to keep proving themselves to their teams and colleagues. They are reluctant to step into the unknown – concerned about losing the respect and confidence of those they manage. Asking them to leave ‘ego’ behind is a much bigger challenge. So, offering an experiential exercise becomes high risk for the facilitator and participating is high risk for the manager. It may be rejected as ‘demeaning’, when in fact it is just too scary!
Knowing this can help the learning designer to choose and frame appropriate activities and consider the appropriate level of ‘confrontation’ that the activity, and the facilitation, offers. The more successful and senior your team, the more likely they are to respond positively to the challenging experiential learning opportunities you offer. For all sorts of reasons, primarily to do with organisational politics, senior leaders are starved of in-depth, unfiltered, authentic feedback. Well researched, well-designed and well-facilitated experiential learning provides a rare opportunity for senior leaders to tap into the support and challenge that they are hungry to receive.
For more information about RSVP Design’s work with Senior Leadership teams, please contact us via the website
http://rsvpdesign.co.uk
17
Informal, work-based learning: are you keeping up with the shift?
3 Comments | Posted by ann in Learning Design, Learning Experiences, Learning Tools & Resources
Everything that I am reading at the moment from the ‘movers and shakers’ in the world of organisational, management and leadership learning convinces me that there are some exciting new insights that are going to bring about a real revolution in our understanding of training and learning in the workplace. Here are a few , probably contentious suggestions I’d like to make, based upon the trends that I’m hearing and reading everywhere, that might help us to move this revolution along!
1. Recognise that informal learning is significantly more powerful, and more highly valued than formal learning. Therefore, shift the investment (both time and finance) away from the design and delivery of formal programmes (face-to-face or online) and transfer it to creating and supporting informal learning.
2.Remove the word ‘training’ from your corporate vocabulary. If the concept of ‘training’ goes, so does the idea of learners being controlled and ‘processed’. We train animals for obedience: we engage human beings by helping them to learn.
3. Embrace new technology but don’t impose it: create multiple ways in which people can easily access and use a variety of media to gather the information, knowledge and expertise they need, when they need it. Divert your training budget to create multiple informal spaces and learning environments. Create resource centres, both physically and on-line, filled with versatile materials that are freely available to individual learners for use whenever they need them. (cf. Apple’s introduction of itunes university). And believe that anyone using these is ‘at work ‘….not playing truant or abdicating their responsibilities!
4. Ensure that Performance Management is a developmental, learning process: link learning and performance by setting goals that use the framework, “I need to learn X in order to be able to do Y”.
5. Only appoint managers who understand and use effective developmental coaching. No matter how good their technical skills are, if they don’t have great people development skills, don’t promote them into managerial positions.
6. Replace formal conferences with open space, cross functional gatherings, with specific outcomes, and facilitate groups as they they tackle issues of real organisational importance in an innovative atmosphere.
7. Measure project success against performance and learning criteria. Build learning reviews into every process. Ask, “What do we need to learn to be successful in achieving this project? How do we incorporate that into our plan?”
8. Scrap any meeting that is a presentation or exchange of information available through other media. Replace these with ‘learning exchanges’: group reviews of learning, how to share and apply it and how to impact anyone who would benefit from it.
9. In a market place in which more and more potential employees are well-qualified and ‘certified’, start to focus on learning with new employees before they join. Interview and recruit with a focus on what candidates have learned, how they learned it and how they will continue to learn throughout their employment. Select those who understand and are motivated by learning. Take every new employee through a personal coaching session around their own Learning Power: create a personal learning record that stays with the learner for life and replaces the CV.
10. Remove any responsibility for L&D from HR. The functions are fundamentally different. Create a ‘learning support’ function staffed entirely by skilled facilitators and coaches and give them free rein to create personalised learning programmes. Integrate personal learning goals into daily work.
OK – there are a few details to work out, I concede……
What do you think?
8
RSVP Design and Interel form new partnership!
0 Comments | Posted by Graham in Learning Design, Learning Experiences, Learning Tools & Resources
I am delighted to announce that Interel Inc. from San Francisco and RSVP Design Ltd. are forming a new partnership that will see their respective product portfolios merge and both organisations work together to continue to support customers around the world with the most effective activity-based learning tools and learning design support. Although RSVP Design and Interel have worked together informally for several years this is a new development in formally providing all shipping and logistical support for both sets of products. Interel in the US will support all US customers and RSVP Design in the UK will support all non-US customers – both sets of products will be available for purchase from either location.
Key product designers Boyd Watkins, Geoff Cox and Ann Alder have worked together before but this announcement signals an intention to provide a truly global and probably unparalleled level of experience in designing effective learning environments.
You can download the official press release here: RSVP Design & Interel Press Release
Please visit the RSVP Design online store to see the additional Interel experiential learning devices now added. Larger scale devices like Pyramid, Network and Mosaic provide some fantastic new tools for large group meetings and for use in outdoor environments.
1
Is organisational learning really learner-centred?
1 Comment | Posted by ann in Learning Design, Learning Experiences, Learning Tools & Resources
This was the question I was asked this morning by an interviewer who telephoned me and wanted to include my response in an article for a training journal.It was 1130 and she wanted to go to press by lunchtime, so I was asked to think on my feet!
She modified her question and said, “What are the five most important things Learning and Development specialists can do to ensure that the training they offer is really learner-centred?”
In the 10 minutes I was allowed, I came up with the following five. I wonder what yours would have been?
1. Understand how learners really learn. The work the University of Bristol has been doing on ELLI seems to have defined the key dimensions of learning: everything effective learners do. Tim Small of ViTaL Partnerships said of the lead researcher Ruth Deakin-Crick, “If there was anything else that effective learners do, Ruth would have found it. We believe this really is the ‘DNA’ of Learning”.
2. Make learning problem-based and purposeful. Adult learning needs to be relevant and useful to the learner, helping them to solve problems, generate innovations and make their lives more rewarding. Tap into the desire to solve relevant problems and use these as the basis for your learning design.
3. Identify and use past and current experience. Link new learning to what is already in place. Identify if and when it conflicts with what is already ‘known’: explore how to integrate new pieces into old patterns.
4. Use simulation. Simulations allow us to explore and rehearse in a safe environment, encouraging experiment and risk-taking. What we learn in the ’synthetic’ world we can transfer to the ‘concrete’ world. In relation to this, there are some interesting figures related to computer based simulation in the report below. Dr. Geoff Cox’s doctoral thesis suggests this is also true of behavioural and ‘physical’ simulation, although the figures given here only apply to computer simulations.
Overall, declarative knowledge was 11% higher for trainees taught with simulation games than a comparison group; procedural knowledge was 14% higher; retention was 9% higher; and self-efficacy was 20% higher.
For anyone wanting to review the whole paper you can find it here: A Meta-Analytic Examination of the Effectiveness of Computer-Based Simulation Games
5. Attach emotion to learning. Emotion drives behaviour. If we attempt to learn in an emotionally ’sterile’ environment we are unlikely to become engaged and motivated enough to press for real behavioural change. This is why experiential learning – with its associated frustrations, anxieties, challenges, satisfactions and passion – remains such a powerful technology.
I’d be interested in your additions to my top five!
12
Some new terminology – jolts and 3 brain training
1 Comment | Posted by Graham in Learning Tools & Resources
We have been struggling for several years to adequately describe what we do in terms of our ‘30 second elevator pitch’. It’s that horrible bit when an acquaintance or even a close friend/relative says ‘Graham, what do RSVP Design actually do?’ We use terms like experiential learning or activity-based learning – but these typically only work for people who are immersed in learning & development and understand this jargon. I was glad therefore to read a couple of articles recently which describes some of what we do in more plain English terms. The first was the wonderful Thiagi (see http://www.thiagi.com/index.html ). Thiagi was talking about ‘Jolts’ – short pieces of activity/games/training that can be used to ‘wake-up’ delegates and remind them that things were not what they thought, or to ensure that they are ready to accept a change in pace, direction, content or some other move in terms of the training programme. What I love about Thiagi’s philosophy is that he still maintains that you spend every second you have with your learners focused on delivering the required learning outcomes (even although he sometimes uses some very simplistic ideas that I think might not work with a typically cynical UK senior management group). This is in contrast to many US-based trainers who still use rubber chickens and a host of other childish ice-breakers that they genuinely believe will somehow make people more responsive to their forthcoming, and finally relevant, learning content!
I think a ‘jolt’ is a good example of what we provide through some of our learning tools and helps people understand what we mean by creating ‘learning tools that are effective and engaging’. I’d consider tools such as Challenging Assumptions, Images of Customer Experience and Seeing the Point as successful ‘Jolts’ . Although Thiagi maintains Jolts should be short in time duration, I’ve also seen many wonderful insights created through a Jolt delivered by a longer experiential activity like Colourblind that can take 30 minutes to complete. I do think people often need a good amount of time to really reflect on the ‘Jolt’.
The second article discussed the ‘triune brain theory’ (also important in Whole Brain Learning Theory) and the fact that although humans have many specialist parts of our brain, a lot of training seems only to be aimed at particular parts. The triune brain theory model considers our brain as evolving from three distinct parts – the reptilian brain, which manages typical ‘fight or flight’ responses; the mammalian brain or limbic system which manages emotions and memory; and the neo-cortex or ‘upper’ brain which deals with logic, analysis, synthesis etc. A lot of training aimed at the so-called higher-order thinking processes can forget to include key areas such as emotion and memory – much of which makes learning ’stick’ and therefore be more likely to be applied, and is key in behavioural change. This article can be found in the October 2010 edition of Training Journal: ‘The Three Brain of Training’. There are a lot of tips and techniques for trainers that we would certainly agree with – and would also suggest that well designed experiential activities can provide the necessary engagement with all three brains:
1. They can provide that ’safe’ environment necessary for rehearsing new skills and behaviours, satisfying the reptilian brain
2.They can provide the emotional engagement for the mammalian brain through providing engaging and elegant game play that can provide a memorable ‘anchor’ for later recall and application
3. They can provide the necessary challenge required in adult learning that is also clearly linked to workplace issues, to satisfy the upper level thinking processes for the neo-cortex that allows for generative learning where participants can integrate their new learning with old models.
I’m happy tell people that ‘we design games that engage each one of your three brains!’
7
Change Management – an experiential approach?
0 Comments | Posted by Graham in Learning Design, Learning Experiences, Learning Tools & Resources
I’ve had a number of conversation recently around the subject of change. These have ranged from clients looking to drive change through fairly typical ‘large group meetings’, to struggling how to get people to change behaviours at all, and then how to consistently deliver change management across geographically dispersed groups.
In my opinion all three relate to the same thing: getting people to ‘learn’ and then practise the required new behaviours. As all the ‘learners’ in this case are adult learners then the first issue is to ensure that they understand why they need to ‘change’. Simply telling people is not enough and engaging them in an experiential activity that can sensitise them to the need for change can be a useful way to do this, so
1. Get the large group meeting to do an activity that is aimed at demonstrating ‘How our Customer needs have changed’, or ‘Why identifying and challenging underlying assumptions can be difficult’ is probably better than listening to the CEO tell us something whilst watching 40 Powerpoint slides for 2 hours in a large Hotel Conference room …
2. Consider the learners – their learning styles, learning power, environment, culture and the change management challenge. Give them some ‘rehearsal space’ where they can practise the required behavioural change. Use professional actors to obtain ‘real’ feedback; use experiential activities where the unfamiliar but safe environment won’t prevent people from taking risks they might otherwise not; provide coaching, support and feedback as learners enagage in the repetitive actions that will make them confident and make the new behaviours ‘comfortable’. Behavioural change needs not just the understanding of what the change is but to actually learn and then apply that change in practice – the real workplace is the most difficult place to begin to apply that behavioural change.
3. Don’t rely on the varying quality of ‘message transmitters’ across the world, or individual interpretations of written/emailed statements/briefing documents- use the same experiential activities in each location that will provide a shared global context for the change, yet allow debriefs, reflection times, and generative learning to take account of local issues. Colleagues from around the world can then share their experience of the same experiential environment and use that as a means to explore local implications of global change.
Of course in each of these contexts RSVP Design can provide the tools and learning design skills to help create these change management programems with clients, and hopefully soon I can talk about whether some of these specific conversations have led to successful change management projects!
